Episode 67: Learning to Become an Effective Networker with Mark McKenzie

Episode #67

[00:00:00] Mike O'Neill: Welcome back to the Get Unstuck & On Target Podcast. I'm Mike O'Neill with Bench Builders and we help business owners solve the tough people problems that are slowing their company's growth. Joining me today is Mark McKenzie. Mark is the owner of Atlanta-based Docqmax Digital Printing. Today we're going to be discussing Mark's experiences as a second generation business owner, but it's his networking insights that we'll be spending most of our time on. Welcome mark.

[00:00:38] Mark McKenzie: Well, thank you for having me, Mike, I appreciate the opportunity. 

[00:00:41] Mike O'Neill: You know what Mark has actually, as a result of networking that you and I first crossed paths probably nine months ago. And I quickly picked up on why people refer you in the Atlanta area in particular as the mayor. And I love that description. Networking is something that, we all have understood as business leaders we need to do. But COVID has really impacted that in many ways. And so that's one thing I would love to spend some time with learning a little bit about you, how you have found network to be of value, and maybe you can share some insights, but before we do that, Mark, can we talk a little bit about your business Docqmax? 

[00:01:31] Mark McKenzie: So, I am in business. We are a second generation family owned business, my brothers and I, work together and own the business. And, we've been in business since 1975, which means we've been, serving the Atlanta area businesses, for 46 plus years. And, we are basically a traditional printer. We produce a lot of our products digitally. We, which means we put toner, paper and substrates, but we still have offset printing presses. So we still put ink on paper and substrates. So, you know, we do everything, being a traditional printer, we do everything from business cards, brochures programs, pocket folders, you know, all the marketing material that, businesses need. We're mostly a B to B, a printing company, but we do have several longtime clients that we help them with their holiday cards or their greeting cards or personal projects, personalized stationary. So with our focus is usually with B to B, and, we try to help businesses, with their branding and imaging products. So .

[00:02:44] Mike O'Neill: Mark you've made note that this is a second generation business and that you're in business with your brothers. And I guess as I step back and, and reflect on you're in the Atlanta area, I know you have customers outside of the Metro area. Our listeners are from literally all over the U S for that matter all over the world. But one of the things that we can all kind of relate to is it sounds to me that the business that you're in, when people hear, oh, you're a printer, they automatically make assumptions. How in a world, can you, and do you and your brothers and colleagues, how do you differentiate? What is it y'all do. That's different in it in the way that everybody else does?

[00:03:34] Mark McKenzie: Well, it's providing value day in and day out and that is one of the things that I use in my networking opportunities is, you know, I help connect others with opportunities and revenue, and I do that through print. But I also do that through networking and building strategic partnerships and finding strategic partners that can help provide value to the client and some prospects that I deal with on a daily basis. And it's not about me winning a printing project, it's me about providing value to the client. So the client is able to get the project done that they need. Whether it's through me, one of my friendly competitors that I would refer to, or, or just advising them on the best strategy. And, I'm gonna say, you know, a lot of times it doesn't include Docqmax Digital Printing. It includes us when we're giving the referrals and the introductions and the, and the information. But, and we may not be the actual person doing the printing of our client's project. And it's because there's a better fit out there for the client. And that's the value we offer day in and day out. So, and, and we strive for it. You know, it's important to make money. That's how you stay in business for 46 years. But, it's not as important as creating relationships and, and being there for the people that have helped you succeed along the way. So that's the value we offer day in and day out. We do have a website that's fully functional. You could go on there and design business cards, brochures, flyers, programs. I think we have like 60,000 templates that you could go on and to your own design. If you, so wanted to. It's it's designed edit is what we call it. And so there's opportunities for us to compete with the other online printers, but it comes back to the value and getting to know who our customers are and how we can help them.

[00:05:49] Mike O'Neill: That sounds like a natural transition to just networking. When people hear the word networking, they might envision walking into a big room, perhaps with strangers and going around with a pocket full of business cards. That is a form of networking, but can you just kind of walk us through when you think of networking, what ways do you envision networking?

[00:06:17] Mark McKenzie: So, I have a term it's, it's called conduit to connections and that's, something that I try to try to be. I try to be a conduit to connection. So the people I'm connected to and the people I am connecting to, I try to be a conduit. I, I try to connect the dots, so to speak. So I, an event, a networking event, or to a speaker series or whatever, you know, whatever event I'm at. I'm always trying to learn more about the people I'm meeting. And also expanding their network with my network and allowing them to, meet the people that I know that might be able to help them with their problems, their issues, with positive solutions and opportunities that you know abound, I guess, throughout the, throughout the world. And it's being that conduit for the people I meet for my clients, my prospects, my friends, and my strategic partners and my competitive, you know, businesses that I compete against daily, you know, the friendly competitors. It's about being a conduit. It, and it there's enough business in this world to go around and I try to do what I do, and I try to do that well, but if I can't do it well, let me introduce you to somebody that is more knowledgeable, that understands what you're looking for. And that's the intent of every networking event. Every zoom meeting I go on is to find those dots that can be connected to develop those relationships, which, Gary Vanderchuck was talking about it in a Taylor Swift rule is what he called. It is a pipe, one of his little, posts that he had on LinkedIn. And it was talking about, you know, I've heard it numerous times, but you know, going an inch wide, but miles deep and developing quality relationships with the intent purpose on being a value to others. And that's kind of how I go through life now is trying to be a value to others. 

[00:08:37] Mike O'Neill: There have been several terms you've used thus far. Value to others. You also have used the term, a friendly competition. And you've said it two or three times. So it's not something that, you just throw in. It, it sounds, is it at your core, if you and your colleagues conclude that what is needed by the prospect, you cannot provide, you still are providing them a you're serving as a conduit. You're introducing them perhaps even to a competitor. It's the spirit of that, that I'm most interested in spending more time on learning from you. And that is you've mentioned, networking in a variety of settings. You've identified could be just a pure networking event. You've described, groups that you're part of. In terms of how networking has changed in the last 24 months. We're recording this in early December of 21. Obviously we are recording this using zoom and at the beginning of the pandemic, I fortunately already had a zoom account, but a lot of folks I knew had never heard of zoom. First of all, how has networking changed in the last 24 months? 

[00:10:04] Mark McKenzie: Well, you know, I'm one of those people that did not have Zoom, because I meet face to face, personal, you know, network. That's how I've always, you know, in a 46 years of business, that's how I always went out and found opportunities was going out there and being face to face and being present and with intent on connecting with quality people. So I was one of those people that didn't have zoom. So I had to learn quickly how to pivot and, it wasn't pleasant for the first, probably six months. I have a tough time at zoom meetings and zoom networking meetings. And, because it, it was not as personal as I was used to. But you have to focus on being intentional with everything you do. And my intent is to help others. And so what you do is you basically, instead of doing a one-on-one coffee at the Starbucks or the Buckhead club, you do a one-on-one zoom call with the people that you're meeting on these networking events and you get personal with them and you meet them one-on-one there, you know, or two to one. I, you know, there's several times where I'll bring a, you know, look at connecting those dots and I'll say, well, here's somebody that you should meet. Let me bring us all together on a zoom meeting. And then we can have a conversation and, enjoy one another's company. With the, with the thoughts that there might be opportunities for us to help one another and possibly do business. So it's it is, but there's still the personal part. Every interaction and that's writing personal, thank you notes for taking the time to still meet with you. You know, you still do those, you still do that follow-up. And, it's a little bit harder. You don't know where people are, so you have to ask, I mean, you know, I, I, I have to ask what your home address is, so I can send you a personalized note. You know, it's those things that make a difference. I think that, you know, I had a post recently on LinkedIn about, do you talk to the speaker or the presenter before an event? And I, I talked about Marc Golin who was with Roadie. He was the founder and started a Rodian. We originally met in 2015 when it was, you know, basically face-to-face meetings and he was presenting and, you know, I bumped into him at the Buckhead club about, three weeks ago and I just reminded them of a, of a piece of advice you'd given it, given it that presentation. And I thanked him for it. I congratulated him on Roadie, was just recently acquired by UPS and I congratulate on him and he was busy going into a lunch meeting. And, but he grabbed my business card and he sent me a personalized note thanking me. And then he sent me all this roadie gear, swag that, you know, a t-shirt just the right size t-shirt for a extra large man and, you know, a ball cap and koozies and, you know, what CEOs do that, that type of thing, you know, and that's that inch wide mile deep that we talk about. And those are the things that are, you know, it impresses me when, when a founder and CEO takes the extra three, four minutes to write that personal note thank me and do those things. And that's what we still have to do with zoom meeting. We still have to write those personal notes. You know, I, I like, you know, I'm in printing, so I like paper. I like ink and paper and I like personal handwritten notes, but you know, even a follow-up email, it would be sufficient. I don't think that a personal hand written note is there's a mail moment to it and there's appreciation to it that you don't get from a email or a text message, but you know, those are the things you have to do in zoom. So you still have the basics of, networking and developing relationships. There's still all those basic things present that you still have to do in your follow-up. And, so really all that's changed is, is that, I'm not able to reach out and shake your hand and grab your business card. Now I have to do a little more, research. But it also doesn't hurt because, you know, there's certain people that I can't connect. I mean, I don't connect with, I can't connect with, they don't fit my agenda. I only have so much time and they don't fit the agenda of the people the other people are connected to. And I, I try to be kind and empathetic to everybody I meet. But, at the end of the day, I can't be friends with best friends with everybody. And I can't serve every client that walks through my door. It just, you know, I don't have the capacity to do that. I don't have the equipment, I don't have the knowledge. And that's the same thing with networking. Is I don't have the tools necessary for every person that I meet out networking. But I do help. The whole theory is that I have, and the intent I have is to provide opportunity and possibly revenue opportunities with the people I connect with. So thats kinda where I'm at.

[00:15:34] Mike O'Neill: Mark you and I are a part of a relatively large and growing networking group, but it was when you and I had opportunity to set up a one-on-one. That as we set up one of those zoom calls, as you just described, and you made the offer to make an introduction to someone who you feel I should meet, and what really prompted me to say, you'd be a great podcast guest is this two to one idea. And that is rather than just fire off a Mike meet Johnny, Johnny, meet Mike. And there's nothing wrong with that. You offer to, to be part of that connection. And that caught my attention. Can you tell us a little bit more about how did that work and why have you found that that is something that you like to do periodically.

[00:16:28] Mark McKenzie: You know, first of all, I spent a lot of time in LinkedIn and I always try to do an introduction prior to the introduction. So I'm not wasting your time if I'm trying to introduce you to somebody, but the person I'm trying to introduce you to, I'm not wasting their time either. If they have the time and they want to meet with you, I do a, share your profile on LinkedIn with that individual and say, here's somebody I think you should connect with. There's numerous times where the CEO or, you know, a VP or whoever a business owner is too busy at that moment to make that connection. And we're talking about trying to make quality connections, and if they're too busy, then, that connection will never really work to the value that we want it to work. So I try to do intros prior to the intro a lot of times, but I do have some strategic networking partners that I know if I made the introduction, they're going to say yes, whether they're busy or not. They're going to say Mark knows me enough that he knows my business. He knows the type of people I'm looking for to connect with. I'm going to take that introduction. So I just do the introduction right there. But I also want to ensure that any introduction I do becomes a positive connection for all of us. So every, every party involved, because the value I provide, it also provides value to me when I can connect two people that become friends, they develop a quality relationship. It becomes valuable to me as well, because I have two friends that are thinking of me every time they see each other, you know, that little conduit that helps make those connections. So doing a, last last week I, I actually was Monday. I actually had a small breakfast. I I'm a member of the Buckhead club and we had basically six of us sitting around a table for breakfast. And, it's, it's a small group I participate in, but we don't know each other that well, and I invited them to breakfast so we all could connect. We learn a little bit more about each other. We spent two hours talking and bringing in, you know, getting more information about one, another sharing ideas and thoughts, personal information. And the value in that is, is that everybody walks away feeling like they're more connected with the people that they strategically want to be connected to. And the ones that could possibly be a client or they could actually be another referral partner for those individuals. That's the importance of, of doing, you know, sitting in a room or sitting on a zoom call with three people, as opposed to two sitting in a, in a room with over coffee with two people, you know, as opposed to three people, as opposed to just two, because what you're doing is you're developing those relationships and you're being that conduit. And it actually provides more value in the long run to those relationships. And, I just, I see the value in it. I actually learned this, from, several other, people that I, that I watched network, you know, there's a, individual, her name is Darrah Brustein. And she basically has network under 40 is, is one of her groups. But she basically, now she writes about intent and, being a great, you know, being a good person around the world. But she is a great connector and she'd been a long time friend. And, you know, it's funny because I used to think that I was the one helping her, but in reality, she was the one that was always helping me. And, you know, it's, it's things like that where you, you sit back and you realize that by connecting others, you actually get to learn more about the people that you're dealing with. You're developing those relationships that matter, and you're doing it with intent. And, you know, I scrambled through many a years without the, purpose of intent. I just winged it, thinking I was good enough. I could wing it. And once I started doing it with intent things around me changed and they changed for the better. And, so that's, that's really one of those, items that you look at is, but you can always learn from those people that you're connecting with. And especially if your, I like to say, I network up, I try to be, you know, my dad used to always say, you run around with dogs, you're bound to get fleas, but if you want to be a millionaire, go find five millionaires and hang out with them. And you'll soon be a millionaire, you know? And I could do that in several levels. I do it in the wealth end is, you know, the wealth end of that. I try to hang out with successful business owners that are making a lot of money, but I also like to hang out with people that give back to the community and, you know, their focus is not money, but it's improving the world and making a difference. So, you know, you hang out with people like that. Your attitude changes, your environment changes, possibly your pocketbook, your health, all those things, change, but you have to network up, you have to challenge yourself. And then once you get up to that million dollars. You got to start hanging out with people and make $20 million once, you know, those are the things. So you start networking up and it's not about money. Like I said, I, I have a friend that, Tim Turner runs, Satisfeed Gwinette, and he feeds people. He actually makes, banana boxes. And I think he does, he feeds 200 and some families a month, or I think it's per week if he's about 200 families per week. But those are the things, I mean, you learn gratitude, you learn to be graceful. You learn empathy for others, all those things by hanging out with an individual like a Tim Turner. And once you start getting that, then all of a sudden, you're the person that's going out helping feed those people because you realize how important those things can be, not just to yourself and, and your inner inner well-being and your soul, but to the soul's others. So, that's kind of how.

[00:23:04] Mike O'Neill: Mark, I was hoping that we would not necessarily dwell on the mechanics of networking, but the spirit in which one goes about you refer to it, the intent. The intent to really be an effective conduit to connections. The understanding that there is value in stay an inch wide, but miles deep. And that it's not so much the number of people that you are getting business cards from or connecting to on LinkedIn, but it's the quality of those relationships. And you raise an excellent point and that is in doing so, even when you are introducing someone, you know, to someone that is maybe new, is that you're learning more about the person, you know, in that process. So they even deepens an existing relationship. And in another point you made, that I can't stress enough. And that is when people asked Mike, what are advantages to being a podcaster? That probably the biggest advantage I have found is I learned from the guest. I'm learning from you. You can't see you because it's right off camera, but I'm writing notes left and right as you're sharing kind of your thoughts on what networking is and maybe what it should not be. And how you have adapted maybe a little bit awkwardly at first, but how you have adapted to a more virtual environment. But you're trying to remind us as leaders that you don't want to lose sight of the personal touch. 

[00:24:44] Mark McKenzie: Right.

[00:24:45] Mike O'Neill: It can go a long way. Mark, as you kind of reflect on the time that you've been doing this 40 plus years. Can you share an example where perhaps you or a client got stuck and what did you do to get unstuck? 

[00:25:02] Mark McKenzie: So, and since we were talking about networking, we'll, we'll stay in that, that little, silo, so to speak that. I was, I went to a networking event, you know, as a business owner, I'm very busy and, and but I participated in a networking event. And it was a group it was called Business Clubs of America, and they basically wanted a fee to, for me to participate in a group. They used to have breakfast series, networking breakfast series, and I'd bring international speakers, from across the world. So, you know, they had, one of my favorites is, Vince Papale, who was, the book and the movie Invincible, he was the walk-on for the Philadelphia Eagles. He's a wonderful individual. You know, I got to meet him and talk to him and have conversation, but those are the types of people that would come and speak, you know? But there was also Scott Wadell who, was a commander of a submarine and his submarine surfaced, did an emergency surface and they hit a tour boat outside of Japan. And there were actually people that died in that event. And he took full responsibility as the leader of that submarine. He took full responsibility for that incident and that accident. So, but her name is Tracy Bailey. She was the franchisee of that group. And she was building a network that provided that. And I kept telling her that, you know, Tracy, I said, I don't know enough people that I could bring, you know, cause basically one of the requirements was that I bought a table of eight and I had to fill that table every month with C level business owners, professionals. And I had to fill that table every month and I, and it was a lot of money and I just kept telling Tracy, I, you know, I'm not your person. I don't think that I can do what you're asking. I don't, you know, I'm not, I don't have those relationships to do that. Well, she encouraged me that, you know, Mark, stop, take a look at who you where you've been what your family is doing in this community and your relationships. And they may be your neighbor that owns a business. He would be the person that you would invite to, to the net, the next event. And for me, I did it. I, you know, I, I, my brother and I decided we were going to do it. And so I wasn't fully responsible, fulfilling all eight seats. It was three for me and three for him. So we split it up. But as soon realized the whole thing was, is I was networking with my friends. I was exposing my friends, my clients, and colleagues and prospects to opportunities to meet other business owners and other client possible clients and prospects for their businesses. So basically I was giving, so, you know, I would send out, I don't know, 20, invites and I'd get three people there would say yes. But I realized that I was touching people. I was touching 20 people every time I send out the invite, whether they said yes or no, they knew that I cared enough about them and their business to make that invite. And I was basically staying top of mind, which is what we all want to do in life. When we're dealing with clients, you know, it was to stay top of mind. We want to stay focused. And at top of every bodies brain. And by doing those touches, you know, 20 touches, you know, 20 invites every month, I realized that, I was, I became unstuck because I was one of those people that we go to a networking event. Heck I, I can print business cards for almost nothing. So I was, you know, like a card dealer, you know, I'd just sit there you know, I was a blackjack dealer just passing out my business cards, not making those connections, not really understanding the value that I could provide. And I had to have someone else, you know, say, Hey Mark, you really do know how to do this. You just need to be more focused in and have more intent and purpose as the why you're doing. And I soon realized that that was something that I was pretty good at. So, I I'm, I'm not the best I read about it all the time. I try to improve my game. I am fairly good at it because I have a great memory of people. I recognize people 30 years later, you know, that I haven't seen him in 30 years and I see him at the mall and I know their first name. I know where we met him. You know, but a lot of that is because I keep track of it. So I put it into a CRM system. I track it. You know, I, I have a system where I reached back out and I do use LinkedIn a lot for that. You know, it's, that's one of the great things about LinkedIn. It's a great fabulous tool. And I started using LinkedIn when I first started with that group because everybody was asking me to connect with them. And then I realized the value of LinkedIn. And, in my processes of developing relationships, inches wide, and miles deep. 

[00:30:34] Mike O'Neill: Mark, I'm glad you mentioned that you do use a CRM because as I was listening to you. Kind of asking myself how in the world do you keep up with all of the connections that you are making or want to make? You mentioned LinkedIn as a very valuable tool that you're using. Do you use another CRM? In addition to that? 

[00:30:54] Mark McKenzie: I, I have tried HubSpot. I've tried Salesforce and I originally started with my app database. I think it was 3.0 back in the early nineties. And I have probably 12,000 contacts and information on those people in my database now. Are all of them current? No, they're not. But, when I reconnect with people, I see them, you know, like I said, I see them as the supermarket, I've put that information in. I try to keep track of that. I try to keep track of their kids, their dogs names, you know, all those things that are crucial to developing quality relationships. My, as I get older, I realized that I can't remember everything. So if I'm not writing it down, like, you know, I have my little notepad here as well. I'm writing things down, that, you know, I'm thinking, well, I can improve on this. Right. I need to connect Mike was this individual just through this conversation. And, those are the things that could go into the CRM. You know, when I sit down and do that on it, pretty much a daily basis. And, you know, I can also look as to when I connected, how I connected. If I send them a note card, I put that in there. If I'm sending them, if they're on my mail list, that I send them, you know, I have information on that. If they're on my email list, I have information on that. I can't do it without the tools to do it properly. Now. Like I said, I do have a pretty good, memory. And I recall faces and names fairly easy, and I remember where we met and how we met. I say probably about 80% of the time. Not always, but, I, it's something that my uncles, I have two uncles, and they they're in Wichita and you'd ask, well, do you know, Bill McKinsey and I don't know Bill, but I know his brother, Jay JT, and, you know, they were known all over the city because they knew everybody. They remember people's names, they remembered kids' names. So they would remember the names of your three sons, which, and where they went to school, you know, high school and probably even college. And, and my Uncle Bill was phenomenal on that. He was actually a partner in our business, early on. We actually bought him out in 1990, but, you know, he was an absentee owner. He lived in Wichita Kansas. It is, a trait that kind of runs in our family. My son's pretty good at it. My granddaughter is really good at it. And it's, sometimes it's a curse sometimes it's, it's a blessing and I look at it more as a blessing than a curse. So. But you do have to have, I, I firmly believe that you have to have systems, you have to have intent. And part of that intent is knowing what you're looking for, recording what you're looking for, having your goals, even before you go to a networking event, know what you want to get out of that, that, event. Don't just show up, as a gunslinger or a blackjack dealer, just passing out cards and hoping. Have intent, have a plan and work that plan, and you have to have the tools to support those plans. And I use hack an act database for that, for part of that, one of those tools. You know, I use an email service for my emails. I use my LinkedIn is a very valuable tool for me. And, I don't have a paid version. I I, every month I think I'm going to go ahead and get a premium and do the sales navigator, but I probably will have to eventually, but, if I want to up my game a little bit, which is overall trying to do is improve on ourselves and our mission.

[00:34:44] Mike O'Neill: So Mark, I think you're be in very modest. And as if you want to up your game, you have shared so many valuable tips with us today. You stress the importance of quality connections. If people want to connect with you, what's the best way for them to do that? 

[00:35:02] Mark McKenzie: Well, they could connect with me on LinkedIn is Mark McKenzie. But a great way is just send me an email. It's mark.mckenzie@docqmax.com that's .qmax. And, you can reach me via email or you can call the office at (404) 724-9963. And if you ask for a Mr. McKinsey, you're probably gonna get, one of my brothers. So, that work in the business. So you need to ask for Mark McKenzie, if you want to connect directly with me. 

[00:35:41] Mike O'Neill: All right. Great suggestions. We will include the email, and I'll try to remember include the phone number in the show notes as well. Mark, this has been a blessing for you to be able to share with us. Thank you. 

[00:35:57] Mark McKenzie: No, thank you, Mike. I appreciate it. I appreciate our friendship that's developed in the past nine months or so. And, I'm looking forward to, continuing that relationship and making it opportunities for revenue as well as blessings. So thank you. 

[00:36:14] Mike O'Neill: Well, Mark, I also want to thank our listeners for joining us today. Every Thursday, we upload the latest episode to all the major platforms. So if you haven't already please subscribe. I got a question for you. Are people problems keeping you up at night? If yes, let's talk, head to bench-builders.com to schedule a quick call. We'll explore ways to help you solve those people problems so you can again, focus on growing your business. So I want to thank you for joining us and I hope you've picked up on some tips from Mark that will help you Get Unstuck & On Target. Until next time.